Blue Moon Fans

The Legend - The Species of Origin
Pneumonica - Mo 17 März, 2008 05:36
Titel: The Species of Origin
Well, I searched thuroughly through the English Legend forum and can safely say that the topic of my question has not yet been addressed therein. Razz It's been a long time since I could read German with any proficiency, so this has probably been addressed in the German language forum. For this, I'm sorry.

I'm attempting to throw together rules to run an RPG set in Blue Moon, and so I'm trying to crank out as much detail as I can about Blue Moon itself. Thus, I can do without knowing more about the Phar (being that they're across the Desert of Morning Light). I can kinda do without knowing the species of the royal family, though that's really stretching it. My question is about the Inquisitors, since such folk are probably still around at the time my game is set (soon after Blue Moon City).

It's obvious from the artwork that they are of no readily-identifiable Blue Moon people - the closest passing resemblance is to the Pillar, Hoax, or Mimix, but it's a vague connection. I have a few theories, probably ones that a dozen people have come up with, but I was wondering if there was anything that could be said officiously (which, for people who know English as well as I know German, is a pun) about them?

Knowing that none of them look much like any of the other peoples presented (not even the Phar), I'm presently considering the possibility that they're byproducts of the Psi Storm, mutant bric-a-brac of the intelligent peoples the way that most mutants are bric-a-brac of different animals. It would thus make sense that they are serving the heirs apparent, since the Psi Storm is the byproduct of the Prince's and Princess' attempts to dominate the animals that were competing.

Or I could just be full of it. If somebody could shine some light on this, I'd appreciate it.
Jack - Mo 17 März, 2008 15:01
Titel:
Hi Pneumonica! First of all: welcome to our forum! It's really good to know that something is eventually "happening" in the English part, which has seemed rather deserted of late. (Save Dearlove's activity of course.)

Personally I suppose the Inqisitors are of human race, as well as the royal family. There was a German thread about this topic, that lead neither to a clear nor to a official result, so thinking of them as human-like should be most accurate imho.

Do you know the Blue Moon book of Frank Rehfeld? (Well, it is only available in German as far as I know.) Inquisitors play an important role in its plot. I can't remember that Rehfeld wrote something about their species, but they had great magical abilities.

Edit: I forgot to express my interest in your RPG!
Pneumonica - Mo 17 März, 2008 16:56
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Love makes the game better, neh? (Sorry - I also enjoy Khindness jokes.)

I do know of the book, but it's been a few years since I was able to read German better than your average four-year-old, not to mention it's a bit difficult to get European novels in the US. I'd go to the effort if I thought I could enjoy the results, but I really don't want to quash my enjoyment by reading at a "one page per ten minutes" reading rate.

As for the "human" theory, I've heard that one for the royal family and I really don't like it, and I especially don't like it for the Inquisitors. It just doesn't sit well with me, especially given that in the imagery two of them look less human than the Hoax or the Terrah, approaching Vulca or Flit in "not-normal-ness". I might just stick with the mutant theory, simply because a) I'm a bit egotistical Rolling Eyes and b) because it settles better with the imagery on the cards, not to mention c) I can make more plot out of it, and that's what really matters.

As for the Inquisitors being all flavors of supermagical... yeah, no kidding. Razz

One way or another, I'm taking it that there's no "offical" answer. That's kinda suck, but I'll live. I'll also probably have several other questions by the time I'm done. I'm already wondering about cities - four are mentioned in the Buka deck (one Hoax, one Terrah, one Aqua, and one unspecified final shelter before Blue Moon City itself), plus Blue Moon City, and I'm beginning to wonder what others are there. Geography is the next topic of discussion, I guess, but not at the moment. Maybe tonight (which might be tomorrow morning for some of you).
Helios - Mo 17 März, 2008 19:46
Titel:
Well, if Geography is ur next topic then u might be interested in this one:

BlueMoonMap

I hope it will help u. But u know that when ur RPG is finished u have to post it here Wink
Geirröd - Di 18 März, 2008 01:45
Titel:
Hi, i'm very interested in your resulting RPG Smile

Pneumonica hat folgendes geschrieben:
As for the "human" theory, I've heard that one for the royal family and I really don't like it, and I especially don't like it for the Inquisitors. It just doesn't sit well with me, especially given that in the imagery two of them look less human than the Hoax or the Terrah, approaching Vulca or Flit in "not-normal-ness".

They are all human (this is explicitly stated in the novel), including the less normal ones like Flit, Vulca or Aqua. That seems to be quite a substantial message of the Blue Moon lore with unity of humankind despite of all the differences and such Wink (well - except that one fighting thing, which makes up the scenario for the card game... Rolling Eyes )
Therefore i think it is save to say, that the royals are human, all the people are human and therefore inquisitors are human, too.

In particular i would guess that the inquisitors are foreign, human "Magicians" (or Psionicians) and their physical appeareance might be somehow "deformed" ("mutated" should imho be reserved for the animal-cross mutants) by their own foul magic (or - the other way around - their bodies are modified to enhance their abilities). The Psi storm would of course also be possible, but it seems that the mutants are very different in terms of their mental state. They are more like victims exposed to sudden attacks of rage, while the inquisitors are manipulative, planning and rather controlled (at least their actions give that impression).

I am not sure if i remember the novel correctly, but in there their origin is also mysterious to the leaders of the Blue Moon people (probably even to Roland and Elinor), which is why i think they are from another country (it would be noticeable, if such powerfull magicians were raised and trained).
Probably from Phar away (to keep the word-puns going).

[bookspoiler]For their powers: At least Grease Palm seems to be very skilled in dominating others mind, but is not able to do so with Tronknor, who is able to defeat him (or her) in a direct confrontation).[/bookspoiler]

Pneumonica hat folgendes geschrieben:
I'm already wondering about cities

I can't remember much on geography, but in general the cities are more or less people specific with Blue Moon City as the big exception. The cities mentioned in the novel are (to make sure you don't miss this in the german text)
helios hat folgendes geschrieben:
Sallanion, Theklis, Calydos und Salanas: Hoax
Nautalia: Aqua
Timbaku: Terrah
Gorghorot: Khind

The predominance of hoax cities is probably due to the fact that the main character is a Hoax. [bookspoiler]Gorghorot is completly burned and inhabited only by a few crippled and xenophobic survivors (crippled Khind are scary) at the novel's point in time. Since the novel is about the acquisition of the "heart" of the Psi crystal, it is shortly before the "Blue Moon City" game.[/bookspoiler]

I think i will re-read the novel and note down everything i can find that could contribute to this... Rolling Eyes
Pneumonica - Di 18 März, 2008 15:40
Titel:
Helios hat folgendes geschrieben:
I hope it will help u. But u know that when ur RPG is finished u have to post it here Wink


Geirröd hat folgendes geschrieben:
Hi, i'm very interested in your resulting RPG Smile


Thanks. And thanks, Helios, for that link. Actually, I suppose my next topic is more ethnography than geography, but having a map already made helps in the RPG department immensely.

Geirröd hat folgendes geschrieben:
They are all human (this is explicitly stated in the novel), including the less normal ones like Flit, Vulca or Aqua. That seems to be quite a substantial message of the Blue Moon lore with unity of humankind despite of all the differences and such Wink (well - except that one fighting thing, which makes up the scenario for the card game... Rolling Eyes )
Therefore i think it is save to say, that the royals are human, all the people are human and therefore inquisitors are human, too.


This sort of begs the question. Alright - they're all "human" (though I think that we're talking human on a reeeeeally sliding scale here). That doesn't explain it. Although I'm tickled by the theory that the Prince and Princess are Phar plants. I mean, little bundles of joy aren't supposed to be shipped in the post, people, am I the only one to realize that?! Wink

At any rate, if they're still a mystery then I can work with that, though I still enjoy the notion that they're a Psionic mix of multiple races.

Geirröd hat folgendes geschrieben:
helios hat folgendes geschrieben:
Sallanion, Theklis, Calydos und Salanas: Hoax
Nautalia: Aqua
Timbaku: Terrah
Gorghorot: Khind


The predominance of hoax cities is probably due to the fact that the main character is a Hoax. [bookspoiler]Gorghorot is completly burned and inhabited only by a few crippled and xenophobic survivors (crippled Khind are scary) at the novel's point in time. Since the novel is about the acquisition of the "heart" of the Psi crystal, it is shortly before the "Blue Moon City" game.[/bookspoiler]


Useful data all, sepecially now knowing the demographics of Sallanion and the existence of Calydos and Gorghorot.

A very rough approximation of geography is usefully located within the Flit deck (though one questions the sanity of a culture that can look at the Jungle of Abundant Life, replete with Tutu, the occasional Mimix, and periodic Giant Elephantine Things of Massiveness(TM) and think of it as "peaceful"). There's also brief notes on the peoples in the Pillar deck - all of two quotes for the Phar. How could anybody say we know nothing of the Phar? Razz

Another question - is there a single language spoken throughout Blue Moon, or several? I'm thinking it a safe bet that the Buka have their own language, and probably also (though maybe not explicitly stated) the Hyla, Tutu, and Phar. So, do Khind speak Khindly and Hoax speak Orwellian? (The puns on this thread are getting worse and worse. I realize that this is entirely my fault, but I'm just saying...)
Primus Magicus - Di 18 März, 2008 16:42
Titel:
I think they all understand each other in the book without translators or something, so I guess its just 1 language (buka as well)
Pneumonica - Di 18 März, 2008 17:21
Titel:
Helios hat folgendes geschrieben:
BlueMoonMap


First, sweet map.

Second, do you have a version without the text labels? I'm the only one in my group who speaks German, so I don't think they'd appreciate a map they can't read. Putting the English labels in I can do - don't even need Photoshop for that.

Jack hat folgendes geschrieben:
Edit: I forgot to express my interest in your RPG!


lol. Thanks. I'm working on the peoples, but I'm not sure if it's to my satisfaction. Right now I'm using the Savage Worlds rules, mostly because I happen to rather like those rules.

(off topic) Just as a note, in case people on these boards read English RPGs and get the wrong idea, "race" does not mean "species". In other words, if you are interacting on this board, then there's at least a solid 85% chance that you are "human", but that is not your "race". That's your "species". Your "race" would likely be Germanic, Teutonic, or some variant thereof, unless you're a Gastarbeiter, in which case you're Turkish. There've been a lot of really interesting arguments I've heard from this, such as foreign persons who play RPGs or read fantasy novels getting seriously offended at the term "Race War". (/off topic)

Interestingly, provided that feathered bipeds with wings and arms can be considered "human", the term "races" could correctly be applied to the peoples of Blue Moon.
Pneumonica - Di 18 März, 2008 18:26
Titel:
BTW - I have more stuff I want to ask, but I can't make new threads. It keeps saying it's detecting some kind of worm attack or what-not. I know it's not the computer, because I got the same message trying to change my signature from my home computer. Who would I contact to fix this problem?
Jack - Di 18 März, 2008 20:47
Titel:
That sounds quite ominous, I haven't heard of a similar problem up to now. And actually I don't have the slightest clue of how to repair this (why should I anyway). If it turns out to be permament, you can contact Ladoik or Erzengel, one of them ought to be able to help you I suppose.

I spoke of "races" and "species" as synomyms, but now reconsidering I think it's important to distinguish one word from the other. Judged by what i've learned in biology lessons (which is certainly not quite up-to-date) it seems right that all people are of the same (human-like) species, but different races. At least if it's sensible to use our system to classify invented creatures. Consequently even members of different peoples should by definition be able to have propagable descendants. Any idea how we could check this?
Unfortunately Rehfeld's novel ended too early to have reliable facts.

By the way, are you intenting to involve the BM-cards directly into your game, Pneumonica?
Pneumonica - Di 18 März, 2008 21:36
Titel:
If somebody could get one of them for me, because now the server's throwing up the CrackerTracker security error when I try to send a PM. This is getting obnoxious.

Jack hat folgendes geschrieben:
Consequently even members of different peoples should by definition be able to have propagable descendants. Any idea how we could check this?

Unfortunately Rehfeld's novel ended too early to have reliable facts.


What you speak of is the bane of every RPG designer's existence.

Player: "So, my mother was the daughter of a Tiefling Werebat and a Half-Green-Dragon Gnome, and my father was the son of a Half-Water-Elemental Human and a Half-Celestial Elf. What are my character's racial stats?"
DM: *head explodes*

BTW, I wasn't specifically referring to you when I made that statement, and I'm sorry that I gave that appearance. I was speaking to a lot of people, because a lot of native speakers of English make that mistake, and unfortunately once it sets in it's nearly uncorrectable (since correcting it risks accusations of "racism", a term that's really silly by the definition of "race" as "human").

Jack hat folgendes geschrieben:
By the way, are you intenting to involve the BM-cards directly into your game, Pneumonica?


Do you mean as an actual game mechanic involving the cards? Most likely not - the cards weren't designed to be adaptable to more than what they were for.

...okay, that sentence needs to be taken out and shot. How about this - the cards don't go beyond their intended purpose very easily. That and I'm not too big a fan of card mechanics in an RPG. It's not that they contribute nothing - Torg is one of my most favorite RPGs in the world and it used a really neat card mechanic. However, they become distractions - the attention of the players should always be directed towards the center of the table or towards the GM (which, in some cases, is the same direction). You look at your character sheet and your dice, which are in front of you (like on the table if you play around a table). If a map is laid out, you're looking at the map. If the DM is talking, you're looking at the DM. With cards, your eyes focus more towards your lap, and that pulls you away from the center of the activity.
Ruwenzori - Di 18 März, 2008 21:54
Titel:
Hi,

Pneumonica hat folgendes geschrieben:
BTW - I have more stuff I want to ask, but I can't make new threads. It keeps saying it's detecting some kind of worm attack or what-not. I know it's not the computer, because I got the same message trying to change my signature from my home computer. Who would I contact to fix this problem?


I think its helpful if you could provide more details about this message. I also never heard about it in regard to this forum.

Whats the exact wording? Is it a message box, maybe caused by any kind of AV software you may have, or is it looking like being generated by this forums software?
Are you reading this forum via any kind of helpers, which may inject foreign code, like google groups and google ads?


br, Ruwi
Pneumonica - Di 18 März, 2008 21:59
Titel:
Sorry to have to do this in a thread and clutter everything, but like I say I can't post private messages at the moment.

This is the error message. It appears to be thrown by the server. In every case I'm browsing using standard Internet Explorer - no intermediary software is being used.

Zitat:
SECURITY ALERT » » » »
CBACK CrackerTracker has detected a potential attack on this site with a worm or exploit script so the Security System stopped the script.


If you can see this page after including a new MOD into your board or after clicking on a link please contact the Board Administrator with this error message and a description what you have done before you could see this page, that the Admin has the possibility to fix the problem.


With one machine it happened whenever I tried to change my profile, but didn't happen when I attempted to post a new thread (hence the one thread I did start). On this machine, it's happening whenever I attempt to post a new thread and whenever I send a PM, but it isn't happening when I attempt to change my profile (hence, I have a signature and such).

Again, I'm really sorry for flooding a forum thread with this technical crap, but I can't find a "technical problems" board on this forum, nor would I be able to post to it if I could.
Ladoik - Di 18 März, 2008 23:12
Titel:
Hi Pneumonica,
this seems to be a Problem caused by the Security Software used for the Board.
I send a Mesage to Xelethotiras, he is the Owner of this Board and had installed this Software, he may know what to do Wink
Pneumonica - Mi 19 März, 2008 03:20
Titel:
Excellent! Thank you.
Primus Magicus - Mi 19 März, 2008 10:06
Titel:
I have had this error a couple of times as well last week after I tried to send a pn. but if I clicked the site away, opened a new one and no more problems...
Helios - Mi 19 März, 2008 16:16
Titel:
Yes, I have a map without the names. I can send it to u via Mail but it seems that at the moment u have some problems. So when everything is fixed send me a PN and we will see what to do.

Maybe the Inquisitors are a mix between two 'races'. And now that everyone kows, that a interracial love results in a desaster they don't do it anymore. But personally I really think that the Inquis were created like the Mutants by this Psi-storm. And the reason why they have now the trust of prince and princess is because they were allready before the storm their adjutants or something like that. And the Inquis don't need to be of the some race. But now in some way they are. And they gained magical power (or had allready before and is now only become stronger).
Well, what do we know about the race of the two leaders, of the dead king? He was respected by all the people of BM. But if the king would have been of one of the races we know from the game that would have let to a civil-war because that would mean that one race rules over the others. So, here I present u now my theorie:
King and Queen don't have children. In fact, as we know, the Queen has to go to receive the heirs of the throne. One who rules and one who assists the ruler, gives him strenght. Were does she now receive the heirs? I think, that in a good Buddhist tradition, she travels from village to village to find the true heirs. Like the Buddhists are doing it when they have o find a new Dalai Lama. And so one could be a Khind and the other a Hoax. That way every king is of another race but allways from BM with the blessing of Ordrac. And because of that one of the two must be a Vulca and the other a Hoax, because these two races hate each other the most. *Spoiler* And we all know how the book ends Wink */Spoiler*
Yeah, my idea.
Pneumonica - Mi 19 März, 2008 17:54
Titel:
Helios hat folgendes geschrieben:
Yes, I have a map without the names. I can send it to u via Mail but it seems that at the moment u have some problems. So when everything is fixed send me a PN and we will see what to do.

Maybe the Inquisitors are a mix between two 'races'. And now that everyone kows, that a interracial love results in a desaster they don't do it anymore. But personally I really think that the Inquis were created like the Mutants by this Psi-storm. And the reason why they have now the trust of prince and princess is because they were allready before the storm their adjutants or something like that. And the Inquis don't need to be of the some race. But now in some way they are. And they gained magical power (or had allready before and is now only become stronger).
Well, what do we know about the race of the two leaders, of the dead king? He was respected by all the people of BM. But if the king would have been of one of the races we know from the game that would have let to a civil-war because that would mean that one race rules over the others. So, here I present u now my theorie:
King and Queen don't have children. In fact, as we know, the Queen has to go to receive the heirs of the throne. One who rules and one who assists the ruler, gives him strenght. Were does she now receive the heirs? I think, that in a good Buddhist tradition, she travels from village to village to find the true heirs. Like the Buddhists are doing it when they have o find a new Dalai Lama. And so one could be a Khind and the other a Hoax. That way every king is of another race but allways from BM with the blessing of Ordrac. And because of that one of the two must be a Vulca and the other a Hoax, because these two races hate each other the most. *Spoiler* And we all know how the book ends Wink */Spoiler*
Yeah, my idea.


I'm behind you at least 80%, and part of the remaining 20% is that I don't know how the book ends. Evil or Very Mad Especially supporting your "Inquisitors come from the Psi-Storm" notion, since I'm of the same notion. Razz I mean, why else would you blindly serve insanity than if you were created as a byproduct of that insanity trying to dominate others.

Here's an interesting quesiton - are the King and Queen married? Mightn't the King have a lover and actual, honest-to-goodness children, and is the Queen by neccessity involved in that? Or, for more correct terms, "sovereign" and "consort", since there's nothing saying the sovereign is the King and the consort the Queen. One interesting possibility is that the reason for the two children being chosen is that one becomes sovereign and the other consort, so the King and Queen are always siblings by adoption.

The most important question to me is this - where'd the Queen-consort go? Why'd she disappear? And who delivered the two bundles of impending civil war to the Palace? And why are the Phar trying to look all innocent? (Was it the Pillar deck that pointed out that the Phar used Psi to bend the minds of others?)
Primus Magicus - Mi 19 März, 2008 21:09
Titel:
Could someone explain to me what "sovereign" and "consort" actually mean? I read it on the pillar cards, but never really understood what it meant.
Further I never read or had the idea that the inquisitors where created by the psi-storm (why would only animals and royal helpers be affected by it??), but if it is the case then helios' explanation is good. I have no other clue what the inquisitors really are or how they became that way.
I really like helios' theory about recieving the heirs. I am not so sure about pneumonica's idea of allways siblings by adoption. That would allways cause jealousy and I doubt one will accept his/here role as "loser" and stay with the other "winner" happy and forever together....

(ps. is there anywhere stated that the Phar used Psi to bend the minds of others?)
Pneumonica - Mi 19 März, 2008 21:52
Titel:
Primus Magicus hat folgendes geschrieben:
Could someone explain to me what "sovereign" and "consort" actually mean? I read it on the pillar cards, but never really understood what it meant.
Further I never read or had the idea that the inquisitors where created by the psi-storm (why would only animals and royal helpers be affected by it??), but if it is the case then helios' explanation is good. I have no other clue what the inquisitors really are or how they became that way.
I really like helios' theory about recieving the heirs. I am not so sure about pneumonica's idea of allways siblings by adoption. That would allways cause jealousy and I doubt one will accept his/here role as "loser" and stay with the other "winner" happy and forever together....

(ps. is there anywhere stated that the Phar used Psi to bend the minds of others?)


A "sovereign" is a monarch, primarch, or other single ruler. Similarly, a "sovereign nation" is a nation that rules itself. "Consort" has several meanings, and as a verb it means "to have dealings with" (a common Church condemnation in the Middle Ages was "consorting with the Devil"). As a noun, it means the spouse of a monarch, but in secondary meanings it can also mean an association (ref. "consortium") or company (especially in music, it means a company of musicians who play the same instrument). Consort can also mean an unmarried sexual partner, usually of a royal person who is in a political marriage.

And regardless of whether they're married or not, the consort always gets the short end of the stick, and regardless there will always be one sibling who isn't sovereign. It's very clear - only one sovereign, only one consort.

I'll need to be home before I can look it up, but I recall one card having made a statement about Psi and the Phar. Best guesses would be Buka, Pillar, or I&E.
Primus Magicus - Mi 19 März, 2008 22:24
Titel:
Well I guess that would be Pillar 20 card then (from the I&E2 set). I can barely read the (german) text in deckdesigner, but it does say something about psi and phar
Pneumonica - Do 20 März, 2008 02:23
Titel:
Got it. Pillar 20, as you said.

Zitat:
Shhh, betwixt us. Where sun is god and Psi makes slaves, Phar gives much good when master arrives but talks much bad when master sleeps.
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